Transcription of Maxwell Chikuta for the show New Beginnings, #68
Lisa: As we head into 2013, we’re talking about new beginnings because everybody is thinking about how they can do new things in their lives. The person that I have across the microphone from me is somebody who I think has had many new beginnings in his life. I first heard about Maxwell Chikuta through a column that Bill Nemitz had done in the Portland Press Herald and I was very impressed with the story of this individual who became a US citizen on September 21st 2012. I’m honored to have you in the studio with me Maxwell. Thanks for coming in.
Maxwell: Thank you very much. Thank you for having me, I appreciate it.
Lisa: Maxwell, we’re talking about new beginnings and I know you’ve had so many. You originally are from the Democratic Republic of Congo and it sounds like you’ve had quite a journey.
Maxwell: Yes, it’s a long journey for me to be here today.
Lisa: Tel me about that. Tell me about what it was like to … first of all what it was like to live there.
Maxwell: Yeah, in the Congo unfortunately like everybody else you live with your family, your parental love. I missed that when I was a kid, the reason being that my parents divorced when I was 8. When I was 10, we had a Civiland I missed that so I didn’t grow up with parental love. Grow up in the third world countries is really difficult. I decided to go into the streets when I was almost 10 and ½. Live in the streets in the Congo it’s really difficult there. I don’t want to go in too much in details but fortunately my grandfather came to my rescue, took me to his village and taught me to be a good person in the community.
Lisa: In the Congo, most people live with families and your parents, you said, divorced when you were 8?
Maxwell: Yes. When I was 8, they divorced and they had 2 kids, 2 boys and 2 girls. I don’t know how they decide this because in the Congo, they don’t have … the wife goes out of the house. My mom left with my 2 sisters and I left with my dad with my elder brother but tradition, if you have an uncle, he has a right over you. My uncle came to pick us so that we can work for him. Unfortunately I was just 12 years old so he pick up my elder brother. I stayed with my father who married another woman. I was calling her Mom. She came with 2 kids, a boy and a girl but those were queen and the prince of my house. It was a rough world for me.
Lisa: You were very, you were very young. Only …
Maxwell: I was very young. I was very young. Yes, and again in Congo there is no law at that time so I was doing all the chores at my house. I will go to fetch water for the family, clean. At the end of the day, you’re the one who eats the leftovers. When school shopping comes, they’ll go saying that “Okay, stay and watch the house. We’ll come back.” When they come back they didn’t find the right size shoes for me and then I’ll get the leftovers from my step-brother so that I can go to school. It was difficult and I was told when my mom left where she went she got married but later on in my life, I was told that she passed. I don’t know how she did and I lost my 2 sisters. I don’t know how they died but she had another child with the man she married, my … I call her my step sister. She’s still alive and when I stay with my dad, it was on May 13, 1978. This date is still in my head because that changed my all life.
Lisa: May 13, 1978.
Maxwell: Yeah, it was on a Saturday.
Lisa: … and then what happened?
Maxwell: I woke up in the morning because I was that kid, I was a pioneer who used to sing and dance for our dictator Mobutu Sese Seko. Every Monday, we would raise up the flag and Saturday would bring the flag down. I was that pioneer in my grade school. On Saturday I had to go to school very early so that I can prepare for the parade but my dad was not home. He was working nights. I was going to school and I had one my teachers shouting my name, “Where are you going?” I said, “I’m going to school.” He said, “Go back home. Don’t you hear that those are big gun fighters. So, it’s a civil war.”
I went back home and the reason why I decided to go to school because in my village, they taught us how to learn and interpret the sounds of the drums. Sometimes they’re calling you for help in another village where there’s a party. Come feast with us or we’ve been attacked or there is a lion or an elephant …
Lisa: This is all because of … all by the sound of the drums you can actually hear different things like …
Maxwell: Yes, but that morning the sound of the drums didn’t make any sense to me. That’s why I decided to go but I was told by my teacher that’s a civil war. That was not … that’s when my life changed really because after the civil war, the International Red Cross came down consisting of American Red Cross and the European Red Cross. They came to help us and I was that child again. I was working with the Red Cross fetching water for them and in return they’ll give me tinned food so I’ll take home to my step mom but when they left, she couldn’t keep with life because she was also poor I think. She focused mainly on the 2 kids. That’s when I decided to go into streets because it was just too hard for me live with her.
Lisa: You were taking care of people in your family and even people that … your step mother that your father had married, from a very early age, from very young and you were a pioneer in your community doing things for your school and the community.
Maxwell: Yes. I’m that … I don’t know it’s a gift of God I think. It’s not that something I learnt. Working in my community, it’s not something I went to school to learn. It’s something which was in me. I’m that person who can just act because I see something, not … I don’t wait someone to tell me to do something. That’s why my teachers at school in every home across, they would put my leadership. They’ll pick me to be the captain of the class. Earlier on I was a pioneer for the assembly. The Red Cross, because we didn’t have water. You have to fetch water. Again I was curious to talk to them so they would send me, “Go bring water” and a couple of my friends really, we were doing that because the rebels won’t shoot the kids sometimes. That was the advantage.
Lisa: If you were carrying water, the rebels wouldn’t shoot you.
Maxwell: No, if you’re a child.
Lisa: If you’re a child? There was an advantage to taking on this additional amount of work.
Maxwell: Yes and also you take water for the Red Cross and they’ll give you tinned food. We had a lot of supply. Again I would go back to my home and we would enjoy the food.
Lisa: … but then was it hard for you to understand if you were this young and you were doing the work for your school and your community and the Red Cross, was it hard for you to go back home and see your stepmother not be able to handle life? Was it hard for you to understand that?
Maxwell: When I was a kid really I had a lot of questions. I had lot of blames why this but as of now, I’ve forgiven everyone.
Lisa: Looking back at … somebody who is 43 you can look back and say …
Maxwell: It’s all right because of poverty maybe if she had enough, maybe she would have taken care of me. I think that way. Yeah.
Lisa: Great. You were on the street by the time you were 10 and you have in your family a son, Maxwell, who’s 8. Can you imagine him or any of your other 3 children being on the street at the age of 10?
Maxwell: Yeah, that makes me cry really. I really … when I see kids here in America at that age … that’s why we have to take care of our kids. I don’t want to see my kids or anybody’s kids in the community to take my path. It was really difficult and when I see my son, I just say I have to work hard to make sure that he doesn’t go that way because it’s a rough road. I was fortunate because in the streets, you have rebels who come and grab the kids to take them into child soldier’s movement. How I survived, I don’t know. I give credit to God. Yeah.
Lisa: The rebels didn’t grab you to bring you in to be a child soldier. Somehow you managed to escape that.
Maxwell: We knew, we sensed it sometimes. When we hear that some people lost their livestock because the rebels come. We know that they don’t have supplies so they are near. We were sleeping in the tunnel, the water drainage near Marapolis and I know that spot very well. I can go hide nobody will find me, even now.
Lisa: In a water tunnel?
Maxwell: Yes. Yeah, so we knew that the danger is coming but again some of my friends were taken into child soldier movement, but as I said, how I survived or escaped … I was not better than any other kids, but I give credit to God himself because he was protecting me.
Lisa: Do you think that not having this parental love from earlier on caused you to need to be more independent and courageous?
Maxwell: In another way, yes. I will give myself 85%. When I look back, I said, “Okay, I have to do better. It’s not something which I am going to use to give excuses to the community. I don’t want to get back into the community because I didn’t get parental love.” When I look back, I said, “Okay, it’s happened and it’s happened for a purpose.” Maybe if I had parental love, I would have not been here. So who knows, it’s all the design of God. I strongly believe that. Again, I use that as a positive inspiration in my life to be where I am today and that’s why I look back to others. I want to inspire them and to be where I am or maybe better than where I am today.
Lisa: How did you get out of the Democratic Republic of Congo? What was your journey from there to becoming a citizen very recently here in Maine?
Maxwell: First of all, it was really difficult because my elder brother, when my uncle took him, they went to Lubumbashi which is the capital city of my state, Katanga. He joined the military because in the capital city when you come to age, you can willingly join the military. He was taller than me and huge.
Lisa: How old was he when he joined the military in the capital city?
Maxwell: I don’t really know the exact age.
Lisa: … But he was taller than you.
Maxwell: He was 4 years older than me. He was working under Mobutu regime all these years until 1997 when Kabila came into power and oust Mobutu. Kabila comes from my country or from my state, Katanga. He was trying to recruit bodyguard from his state so that at least he can have that cushion. It’s like, “You’re from Maine, you are the President. You want at least someone from here.”
Lisa: Somebody you can trust.
Maxwell: Yeah.
Lisa: He’s bringing a bodyguard around him that he could trust.
Maxwell: Yes. Yes. His main bodyguard was Edika Pang. He shared the same name with my family name. Edika Pang comes from my tribe actually. When he saw my brother also in the military and he was so huge, they assessed him and he recruited him to be the bodyguard of the President.
After when my grandfather took me to his village, I worked my way up. I graduated from school when I was 15, primary school. I was selling candies in the street. Then I built a kiosk which is a makeshift where you sell candies, bubble gums. When my brother was in the military, he helped me with some money for my business. The business grew and when he became a bodyguard, he was having of course lot of money, so he sent me $5000. That was the main problem because when the President was assassinated in 2001, it was also implicated that his bodyguards saying that …
Lisa: Your brother helped you out with money, helped you with the money for the kiosk, helped where you were selling things.
Maxwell: Yes.
Lisa: When the President was assassinated that caused problems.
Maxwell: They traced down … They said, “His brother, he’s got money.” Of course may be they got money from someone. I was coming from Tanzania for my business trip. I reached my border and I was searched. I used to collect coins wherever I go outside my country just for my collection. I have lot of them from Netherland, South Africa, Switzerland, and I collected this Rwandese money. I had it with me. It was just for my collection, but when I was searched, they find that money with me. They said, “You went to Rwanda because the Rwandese helped my former President, my dead President Kabila to oust Mobutu Sese Seko. They said, “Maybe I went to Rwanda again to organize so that they can take my brother out of prisons and so …
Lisa: You got in trouble because you had money from Rwanda even though it was just part of your coin collection.
Maxwell: Yes. Yes. At that time, my tribe, again I didn’t want to bring this, because my tribe and the Rwandese were fighting each other. Not that I was involved directly, I’m a Christian. Even he had a friend from Rwanda, we may go together very well but my tribe mates from Katanga they were fighting with Rwandese so at that time it was odd for them to see me with Rwandese money in my pocket. They say, “You have got Katangese how? You went to Rwanda, can you explain, and come back alive?” I say, “I was not in Rwanda. I was in Tanzania. They search. I lost my goods at the border. My pack was confiscated and they took me in prison.
From the prison there was a pastor because I was so much involved in the community. Again, people when they heard that Maxwell is in prison, they say, “No, we’re going to help him.”
Lisa: They took everything away from you.
Maxwell: From the border, yes.
Lisa: From the border and then they put you in prison.
Maxwell: Yes, I was beaten overnight. I was tortured at the border, Sumbalesa border.
Lisa: How old were you?
Maxwell: I was, in 2002, 34 or 33 may be.
Lisa: Still pretty young, but the community didn’t …
Maxwell: Yeah. When they heard about that, you have people who say, “No, we can’t let him, he’s just innocent.” My pastor helped me and sneaked me out of the country. Of course, border was Zambia so took me to Zambia. He arranged for papers for me to come over here.
Lisa: This is the pastor of you church.
Maxwell: He was the pastor of my church, yes.
Lisa: He arranged for you to cross the border and come to the United States.
Maxwell: Yes.
Lisa: Did you come directly to Maine?
Maxwell: Yes directly to Maine because when I was in prison, when my pastor came to visit me, I asked him to take care of my family. My shop was looted, closed, and they went into my house, interrogated my wife and she was traumatized with my kids and my stepsister and the kids all staying with. I had lot of people staying at my place because in my country when you’re well-to-do people, you have your distant family staying with you. When he told me that, I said, “Do something for them.” He took my wife first before he took care of me. That’s why I find myself here because we heard that in Portland you find Congolese and they will take care of you.
Lisa: When you were living there, you had 2 children?
Maxwell: Yeah. They were so yeah because my first born was born in 1997.
Lisa: Two young children and your wife Sally.
Maxwell: Yes.
Lisa: This was before they brought you to Maine.
Maxwell: Yes.
Lisa: You had to, you’ve already gone through now these beginnings in your life where your parents divorced, so you had to go to a different family.
Maxwell: Yes.
Lisa: Then you had to, then you lived on the streets. Then you had to create a new life for yourself with a kiosk. Now you have to start all over again.
Maxwell: Yes.
Lisa: How does it feel to come to Maine with 2 young children and a wife and to start over again?
Maxwell: Yeah, I’ll tell you my kids came later in 2005 but …
Lisa: Your, did you say your wife comes, and you come…
Maxwell: In 2000 …, yeah.
Lisa: You leave your children behind.
Maxwell: Yes. Yeah.
Lisa: What was that like?
Maxwell: It was really difficult because I was going through life and sometimes that’s why I say I give myself 85%, because the 15% sometimes I tend to look back at my life. When things are not working well, I say, “Why me, Lord? Why me? You took me from the street. You brought me where I am and now you’re taking everything I had in my life. Again, I ‘m going to start afresh, why me?”
Again, the 85%, it’s that inspiration I get from God through my faith. I learn to be strong in every situation. Of course losing my goods and my money, it was far much less than having life. I’m still alive. I can work hard. I can have other goods. I put everything aside and just trust in the Lord.
Lisa: When you got here, not only did you come to a new country and have to learn a new language, but you also decided you were going to get an education in this new country. Tell me about how that happened. Actually, you have multiple degrees by now, fast forwarding, but you started back at Southern Maine Community College, is that right?
Maxwell: No actually, I was not really educated in my country. I was almost a graduate dropout because of hardship. My grandfather didn’t have enough to … in Congo you have to have money to go to school.
Lisa: When you were 15 and you graduated from primary school, you still didn’t have a high school degree at that time?
Maxwell: I did not, I did not.
Lisa: You went back and you did that when you came to Maine?
Maxwell: No, no. I came to Portland Maine at the shelter, Mr. Dennis Cooper. He is now retired, I was told so. He said, “Maxwell, I’m having difficulties communicating with you. I’m going to refer you to Portland Adult Education for your ESL, English as second language.” He took me to Portland adult education. I started the lowest English you can get. Whilst there, the director then Mr. Robert Hood just called me saying that I’ve seen something in you. You’re just different from other immigrants. What is your education level? I say, “No, I don’t have high school diploma.” He said, “Okay, I’ll put you into GED program.” Unfortunately, the city at that time could only pay for your ESL because they want you to speak the language, but they couldn’t pay for my GED, but Mr. Robert Hood took care of me and give him all the credit for that.
Lisa: You got somebody who was able to support your, the city paid for the ESL and them somehow Robert Hood found the money for you GED …
Maxwell: Yes.
Lisa: You made it through that.
Maxwell: Yeah.
Lisa: Then you didn’t stop.
Maxwell: I graduated with my GED in 2004. Then lot of teachers and mentors at adult education helped me to adjust with Southern Maine Community College where I took the entrance exam 4 times. The 3 times I was failing the exams because of the English language but I didn’t give up. People were encouraging me saying that you can make it. The 4th time I passed that entrance exam. In 2006, I started my journey at Southern Maine Community College. I graduated in 2006 with my HVAC associate degree which is heating, ventilation, air conditioning and refrigeration.
Lisa: That is Heating, ventilation, air conditioning, and refrigeration.
Maxwell: Yes.
Lisa: What does that enable you to do?
Maxwell: To get a good job because I was just a janitor at Maine Medical Center. I was working in the laundry. Then I worked in VS cleaning. Then I went in operating room. When I got my GED, that’s when I got a job in operating room. When I got my associate degree, I got a job with engineering department where I’m working even now.
Lisa: You were able to use your education and keep working your way up.
Maxwell: Yes. As my education was going up, my work was going also up to the HVAC position which I’m working right now.
Lisa: You also have a master’s degree in public policy management and finance. That’s unusual. You went from HVAC to something very different. How did you decide to go into that?
Maxwell: First I have a bachelor’s degree.
Lisa: You have a bachelor’s degree.
Maxwell: Yeah, in engineering and technology management.
Lisa: Okay.
Maxwell: I usually look an opportunity saying, “What can I do?” I don’t want to be a burden to the community all the time. People help me, but I have to look ways how I can also help my community. I don’t want to be a burden. I decided okay, I’ll go for my bachelor’s degree. I spent 3 years from 2006 to 2009, I used for engineering and technology in Gorham where I graduated with my bachelor’s degree.
Unfortunately, I don’t want to go into politician and jobs are hard to find. I didn’t get a job with my bachelor’s but I decided okay I have to do something related to what I am inside me. Who I am, I’m someone who was raised by the community. As we stayed in Africa that extended village to raise a child. That child was raised by the community. My grandfather worked hard but lot of people came in and even here in America, I find good people here.
People who stood beside me. People didn’t know me. They are not even my relatives. They just say, “Okay, we’re going to help you.” So me looking back saying that why are these people helping me then I have to find voice where I can also inspire other people in the community working in humanitarian work. That’s why I said, “Okay, I have to go with the public.” When I graduated with my bachelor’s degree, I decided to go and pursue my master’s in public service so that I can also work for a public and help others.
Lisa: All the while you’re working at Maine Medical Center and you’re supporting… By now, you have 4 kids and still a wife and you’re still learning and continuing in your 43.
Maxwell: Yes, in 9 years, I have been working full time night shift and pursuing full time college classes, it’s difficult. Taking full classes with limited English, it was difficult for me.
Lisa: Now you’re getting a Ph.D.
Maxwell: Yeah. Yeah. Just started with my Ph.D. program at Walden University. It’s also difficult. Now I’m getting older, it’s not like when I was younger. You can’t just think normally, but yeah, working full time, attending school full time, and volunteering in my community. Other people they say I volunteer full time and parenting 4 kids, it’s really difficult.
Lisa: Yeah, I want to go back to this volunteering piece. You’ve done work with Habitat For Humanity.
Maxwell: Yes.
Lisa: Why was that important to you?
Maxwell: It was important because when I just arrived in America, I was looking for ways to give back to the Red Cross I saw in my country when I was a kid. I was just thinking that these people, they leave their families and risk their lives to come and help us here. When I arrived here, I asked at the shelter, “Where is the Red Cross.” They took me to the blood bank in Forest Avenue, and my supervisor was a relative, this is how it’s working. You know, people they come and donate blood. You take it from them, but I said, “No, no, no. There’s another type of Red Cross. You work with people, rescue them. Oh! Wow! Okay.”
They referred me to Southern Maine Chapter. That’s why in 2004, I started my training with American Red Cross volunteering as the international humanitarian coordinator, and now I’m just a DAT member, disaster action team member. Again Habitat Of Humanity, because we, when I say we it’s not me, but Habitat Of Humanity would provide shelter for the needy families. I saw myself in that regard. I was blessed. I bought my own house, but what about other people? Are they working hard like I do? That’s what prompted me to go and volunteer with Habitat Of Humanity.
Then even at Maine Medical Center up to last year, I was volunteering 4 hours every week even though I was working there for 40 hours. I was working with a help program, working with elderly people, just talk to them. It was a good program when you put a smile in the face of patient, really people appreciate that. I still, I volunteer a lot with City of Portland. I am in the CDG program, community development grant. I am also in Portland public schools where I’m now serving in transition team for a new superintendent.
Why all this volunteering? The answer is simple because I wanna give back. It says that if you don’t have money you can even volunteer 1 hour a week and I’m doing that. I don’t have enough money but my work in the community, I feel like I’m impacting lives. I’ve received lot of cards from people just appreciating what I’m doing in the community. If everyone can do what I’m doing now, I believe our community will be better.
Lisa: Even if people don’t have money or resources or maybe speak the language and maybe they don’t even have an education or maybe they have a lot of children, it’s always possible to give something.
Maxwell: Yes. It’s possible because that look you don’t need to have money for you to inspire someone. When you … just pick a school. Go in grade 4, just read for them for an hour. I’m not a scientist but the brain of the kids in grade 4 that’s where it’s developing much so they’ll have that picture of you in their entire life. That’s 1 hour, are you going to inspire people and you be their picture for the entire life. Just can you imagine? If you don’t know how to read, we have lot of places you can go. Volunteer for 1 hour at the school kitchen. I have been there just to serve meal on the table. See how people really … It’s hard nowadays. Go to school kitchen. You can do something. It’s not that just money. No.
Lisa: I have a lot of questions that I could ask you but I think I want to end with this one. You have, you’re married to Sally. You have Sharon, Mehima, Manuel, and Maxwell. What are the lessons, you’ve provided them with a new beginning with them for them in their own lives. What are the lessons that you hope that you are giving them or sharing with them, your children?
Maxwell: As my daughter even at school she’s an ambassador. She is a Vice President of the club. I’ve taken her volunteering in the community and even my son, Manuel. I’m looking at ways to see that when they grow up, they become self‑sufficient and people can also give back to the community in the sense that they can volunteer. If God blesses them with money and good jobs, they can also do then because it’s in them. I was just laughing at myself there and they saying that okay, we came from the Congo. We say, “Okay, now we’re in America. We’re still struggling to find jobs and but the answer came saying that, “Oh! I’m the 1st one here so I have to pave ways for my kids, for my kids, so that my kids they become better and not really a burden to the community.
That’s the answer that really strikes my head. I say, “Wow! I’ll continue to inspire them to be good people in the community. People at [inaudible 00:39:39] where my son goes, they did appreciate that. Every time I go there, they say, “Wow, your son is just amazing. He has got that leadership qualities, a captain in his soccer team.” I thank God for that. Part of that is the case and introduced them to God when they’re still kids that’s just me and I’m telling them that the community it’s not only race or religions or gender. The community is colorless.
This year we received an exchange student from Japan in our house despite that I have lot of kids in my house but we still received her. We took care of her, showed her places, and why, because I wanted my kids to see that when they grow up they don’t have that attitude to see the color or gender or anything but to see that they were all equal and to respect the humanity as I was told by my grandfather.
That’s why I’m trying to see my 4 kids and other students of health at the learning centers who are different in color, or in gender. I told them the same things and that really need to see that we are blind as far as helping is concerned. That’s why I’m serving to the public. Because the public it’s defined by all definition I just gave you for the race, gender, faith, group. I mix with Muslims and they’re the ones who have nominated me to ICL, Institute for Civic Leadership, but I’m a Christian. People who comeandsay, “You’re a Christian, but how come you’re playing with Muslims?” No, we are all equal into God’s sight that’s why I want to see my kids also take the same path and live better in our community.
Lisa: Maxwell, I am very privileged to have spent time talking with you today and I really appreciate your sharing these minutes with me and telling me your story. We’ve been speaking with Maxwell Chikuta, former resident of the Democratic Republic of Congo but now a Maine resident in US system.
Maxwell: Yes, I really appreciate that. I’m now American who shares same value and I pray to God that I continue to respect and work in this community. If you can just allow me, let me just take few minutes to appreciate few people who really helped me like you just mentioned about my citizenship. I would have not been here today if it was not for ILAP, Immigration Legal Advocacy. They really helped me with my asylum papers and they introduced me to this wonderful lawyer, Mr. James O’Keefe and Margaret. They took me, they dropped me to Boston like 2 times and I’m here because of these people. All those people helped me in with my school, if it’s editing, my home mates. I can’t really mention everyone but really I do appreciate my community. Thank you very much. God bless you. Continue to do what you do good in the community, and Dr. Lisa, I appreciate your time with me.