Transcription of Jamileh Handy for the show Wholehearted Living #126
Dr. Lisa: In Maine, we know that people often have more than one life shall we say. It’s not just personal and professional but even sometimes two different professional lives. What I really enjoy is meeting people whose two different professional lives seems simultaneously very far apart and also strangely connected to one another. This individual that I’m speaking with today is an example of that. Today, I have Jeanne Handy, founder of Jeanne Handy Designs and also a Middle Eastern dance instructor in the studio with me. Thanks for coming in.
Jeanne: Thanks for having me. Happy to be here.
Dr. Lisa: Jeanne, it is now 2014. We’re in a new year. We thought it would be kind of interesting to talk to you about well, both of what you do, the fact that you made this decision in your life at some point, to kind of focus on these two very interesting and seemingly separate things. Tell us first how you came to that place and also you did something different before you even became a designer.
Jeanne: I did. I did. Before I was in interior design, I was actually in social services and women services particularly anti-violence. I worked for a rape crisis center, and domestic violence center, in advocacy and volunteer coordination. Coming out of college, that’s where I thought my passion was and my passion was with sort of advocating for women and lifting women. But, that field proved to be too challenging for me in the sense of leaving it for the day. It was hard for me to do that. I would find myself wrapped in it all the time, angry, sad, things like that. I thought, “Yeah, this isn’t for me. This isn’t what I’m going to do. This isn’t the way I’m going to do this.”
That was early. I was still in my early 20s and decided I didn’t know what I was going to do next so I just kind of went into some transition things and waited, and wondered, and thought. That’s when I moved to Portland in the early ‘90s and thought, “Well, I’m here. I’m going to finally learn how to Middle Eastern dance professionally.” I grew up with this as my heritage. I’m Lebanese. Because I moved here at the time, there was not a big community in the Portland area whereas I left a very big Arabic community in the Boston area. So I missed that and I was looking for a way to sort of reconnect and stay connected with my heritage. I remember talking to my mother and saying, “I’m going to find a belly dance teacher.” She said, “In Maine?” I said, “Yes. I’m going to,” and I did.
I found a great teacher and started studying it professionally as opposed to just a social dance. It’s occurred to me as I got more and more into the dance that this was the way that was I was going to continue to lift women because Middle Eastern belly dance and its really true form. Its classic form is all about honoring the feminine and honoring your body and the power of your body, birthing in particular but not only birthing, just everything that we have. The center of creativity being in the center of our body and our root power coming from there, and just being aware of it and truly living this life through your body, through your senses, and sort of taking that gift and celebrating it, having fun with it.
I thought, “There, now I can do what I found my goal to be and also stay connected to my heritage,” which was at the time was very important to me. Design came soon after that. I really think it was because finding that opened me up to what else I really wanted to do which is that other piece of creativity for me. It really was fate. I, again, found another amazing teacher. My sister heard of a job opportunity, which was actually an office management with an amazing interior designer, Christine Macklin. She said to me, “I know you’re so interested in design. My husband and I had bought old properties that were decrepit. We did what we needed to do to bring them back, did a lot of research on their history, their period, all of that kind of thing.
I was so inspired by that. She said, “You too would probably be really nice fit and you should talk to her.” I called her and asked her if I could interview for her position. She interviewed me and I was really honest. I said, “I can do what you need done but what I really want is to learn your business.” She said, “You know, I’ve been doing this for, I think at the time, it was like 25 years and I have never taught anyone. I would like to do that.” She was an amazing teacher. We arranged for an apprenticeship. I apprenticed with her for three years.
It was fantastic. The philosophy she taught me about design is still a big part of my philosophy in design. I learned so much from her. I feel like if you go with the flow, you’re usually going in the right direction, right? That’s how I got into the field and I just sort of made a decision that I wasn’t going to allow myself to be defined by one thing. So, I’m going to let myself do both of these things and it took me a while to get to a place where I felt like I’m not going to hide one thing for the other. What I found was the client I attract in the design business is the client that thinks it’s really cool that I do this other thing. That’s important because for me good design is knowing your client as a whole person. It’s not just their aesthetic. It’s who they are, how they live, what’s important to them.
Dr. Lisa: It’s interesting to think about belly dance and Middle Eastern dance. I want to make sure I’m using the right terms here.
Jeanne: Middle Eastern dance.
Dr. Lisa: Yeah.
Jeanne: I’m not offended by belly dance. Some people are but it really is because the focus is in your belly but you do use your whole body.
Dr. Lisa: Okay. Well, Middle Eastern dance, I will call it because I don’t want to offend anybody. It’s interesting to think about that and the idea that we’re going to sort of promote the joy of living within our bodies and existing within our bodies. Also the simultaneous recognition that things have been going on politically in the Middle East which has been kind of the opposite of that, instead of promoting the joy of having the feminine form. It’s really all about kind of shrouding the feminine form. I’m not speaking specifically to Lebanon but I think it’s been pretty widely recognized that we’re going somewhere else with that. How has that felt to you to see what’s going on, just in general?
Jeanne: Yeah. It’s a very good point and it’s brought up a lot. I will say this. The women, most of the women who you see shrouded are very aware of their bodies. I would say even more so than most western women. They’re aware of the power of their bodies. They’re aware of sensuality and sexuality, and all of the beautiful things that can come with it. The difference is they keep it among women. They still honor the different things that happen in women’s lives and women’s bodies which I think we don’t do here. In terms of honoring when you start your menstrual cycle, honoring when you age or when you have a baby or any of those things. They still do that.
I will also say that not all Middle Eastern people are of the same religion obviously. The dance crosses all the religions. Now, in the public eye and in some of those countries like in Egypt for example, you aren’t allowed to show your belly even as a belly dance performer but showing your belly came from the West. Historically, Middle Eastern dance performers didn’t start baring their midriff until sort of Orientalism. When it was introduced into this country and in Europe, it was introduced in a way that was really misunderstood about what the dance was really about.
Tourists began to expect a certain thing when they went to the Middle East and saw our performers and the answer was okay. So this costume that bares your midriff and they are very revealing now, came from here as opposed to came from there. You’ll find like in historic pictures of dancers they’re in full dresses, fully covered because not so much about baring your skin as it is about the movement itself.
Dr. Lisa: That’s an interesting point that you bring up that even though what we may see … well, two interesting points. One that not all Middle Eastern countries are the same and so there are differences in how women dress and differences in how women dance. That’s important to remember and differences in religion obviously. But then also that just because we may see that women are now and oftentimes asked to cover themselves that they still maintain this really important identity that we don’t see. It doesn’t mean that they’ve been forced sort of underground, it just means that we don’t have the same access to it that other people might.
Jeanne: Right. I would say that some of it is forced underground. I’m speaking secondhand though. I can’t say that I’ve had firsthand experience of that. I would say that some of the reason, it is hidden is because it’s been forced to have been hidden. It is an oppression of women and just like trying to refuse women education. Trying to refuse them the ability to honor their body is another way of holding power over rather than sharing power.
Dr. Lisa: So it’s complicated?
Jeanne: It’s very complicated. It really is.
Dr. Lisa: As far as you’re helping women to lift themselves up to really celebrate themselves and their bodies, you yourself are a teacher. You also are a practitioner I guess, a professional in the field but you teach this. What type of women are you finding come to you to learn this type of dance?
Jeanne: All different types. It continually amazes me who shows up for class. From the range in age which is… My students over the years have been young girls to, I think, my oldest student was probably 80 or 81. She came to it I’d say when she was about 76. Everybody’s reason is different because where they are in their life is different. You know that’s kind of a given but I think most people are getting to a point and I hear more than anything is I want to reconnect with my body.
I want to acknowledge my pelvis because in this culture, we really are, the way we are trained to walk and carry ourselves, it’s very tight and held. We aren’t used to settling in to our body and just letting … if we left our hips alone, if we didn’t tell them what to do, they would sway. It’s how we’re built, you know this. They would sway. It’s comfortable but we stop it and so it’s mostly people who are wanting to reconnect with their body or either have a new relationship or a better relationship with their body.
Whereas with the younger girls who aren’t so crushed yet by that, they see it and it looks really fun. It’s what they see on TV, it is really fun. It’s flirty and it’s sparkly. It’s fun and flirting is fun. There’s nothing wrong with it when you’re doing it in your power. If you’re doing it and you’re objectifying yourself, well, that’s a shame but if you’re doing it because you first are flirting with yourself then that’s great. Beautiful things come from flirting. We all came from flirting.
Dr. Lisa: How do you think the people … this raises, I want to ask you so many different questions about this because I have two daughters myself. I have a 17-year-old and a 12-year-old. I have a 20-year-old son. How do we get from this place of being a younger, flirtier, sparklier girl to the place where we’re holding ourselves so tightly? I mean I’ve delivered so many babies and tried to have women sort of rest in to their pelvis and let the baby just come the way it’s going to. There is this holding that happens and I see it while delivering babies even. How do we get from point A to point B? What happens to us?
Jeanne: I think that is a… there’s so many sides to that answer. There’s so many influences that I feel make us separate ourselves from our body. I think religion has a lot, not all religions but a lot of religions put shame on the body and on women in particular but on the body in general, men as well not just women. I think the media- which is money-based trying to … it’s like I think what was on the Colbert Report, when he said if we tell girls they’re okay, how will we sell them things they don’t need. I think that’s a big piece of it too.
I think that’s what happens. The more we get these messages that our body is something to be ashamed of and our desires are something to be ashamed of, the more separate we become from our body. And we can’t be separate. We’re not separate. Our body is what we’ve been given to live this life in and so it’s sort of just rekindling that flame sort of that warm relationship is what I’m trying to do with folks. I watch it happen. It’s amazing to me, people, their posture changes.
It’s not just a physical thing. It’s how they carry themselves from the beginning of class to the end of class. It’s different. They walk out differently than when they walked in. Then I think after a while, it becomes habit to carry yourself this way and also just a discomfort. I do believe the younger girls I’m seeing are different now than they were 15 years ago. I think their relationship with their body is better than ours was at their age. I think that has to do with where we are as adult women. What they’re learning from us, I hope that they’re not hearing the shame that we may have heard and I’m not blaming our moms.
They were a product of what they were fed, and I don’t mean food. I mean messages they were given, probably food as well sometimes. I do imagine what would it be like if we celebrated when girls started to menstruate. What if that was the norm? Instead of going, “Okay, this would have to do.” Like it’s a medical emergency or something like that. What would it be like if we acknowledge that birth was a totally natural thing that people have been doing for … and animals and everything for eons and yet we’re still here?
Again, it can be but naturally it’s not a medical emergency or an illness. Pregnancy is not an illness and we treat it like it’s an illness. I think those messages as subtle as they are is what makes us go from feeling like I want to be, “This looks fun and this looks too feeling ashamed or walking small.”
Dr. Lisa: It’s 2014 and obviously men and women who are listening can benefit from having heard your story about going from being in the social services field to becoming a Middle Eastern dance instructor to simultaneously working on becoming an interior designer. They can look to you as somebody who’s brave enough to just be open and follow your path. What are the things can you suggest to people who are really thinking, “I really need to reconnect with myself. I really need to reconnect with my body and my life and my passions.” What would you say to these people who are listening right now?
Jeanne: Listen to your heart. Remove should from your vocabulary. Ask yourselves do you want to? When you’re committing to something, do you want to? I’m not, are you good at it? Is it easy for you? Do you want to? I never understand when people say, “I wish I was in college again. I wish I was in…” because for me life gets better and better. I will say I’ve continued this kind of sort of transforming path. In the past few years, I started meditating and that is amazing to me as a way to get back in touch with your hearts. You said it earlier, we’ve become so heady and part of the balance is getting back to our hearts as well.
If you can get to a quite place, however you do it, and really listen to your heart, What is your heart telling you to do? Also going with the flow so not fighting things so much. If things present themselves step into it, you can’t wait for it to happen. Going with the flow isn’t sitting back and waiting. Going with the flow is saying yes when something puts itself in front of you. Why not? That’s my favorite question. Why not? I can usually not come up with a good reason when I say why not.
Dr. Lisa: Jeanne, how can people find out about the work you’re doing as a designer with Jeanne Handy Designs or as an instructor of Middle Eastern dance?
Jeanne: I have a website which is just jeannehandydesigns.com. People can reach me through that website and they can see some of my work through that website. I have a website mainebellydance.com. People can reach me through there as well. I’m always happy to talk about either thing, because they’re both important. As you said, they seem unrelated but for me they’re not. For me, one is taking care of your soul space so your body and one is taking care of your body space which is your home. They’re both important.
It took me a long time actually to want … I’m revealing something here, but I never wanted to say I was an interior designer. I would always say I have an interior design business but I wouldn’t say I’m an interior designer because for a period I thought, “Oh, it sounds so superficial.” And I didn’t want that. Then I realized a few years ago, it’s not superficial at all. It’s really important having a space that lets you or lets me be the best that I can be is important. It was really an interesting thing. It took me a while to do that. Here I was doing this thing that I love and I was almost more embarrassed about that than I was about the thing that most people would think I would be hush-hush about but no more.
Dr. Lisa: I think a lot of people are going to be relate to that story.
Jeanne: Good.
Dr. Lisa: I think you all carry around some interesting senses of shame about very strange things. When we look at it in hindsight, we think, “I don’t know why that ever happened but … “
Jeanne: That’s right. That’s right.
Dr. Lisa: I’m glad you shared that story and I’m glad that you came in and talked to us today. I’m glad also that you’re helping women to kind of sink back into their bodies through Middle Eastern dance and to I guess relate more fully with their homes through the interior design work you do. We’ve been speaking with Jeanne Handy, the founder of Jeanne Handy Designs and Middle Eastern dance instructor. Thank you for being with us.
Jeanne: Thank you very much for having me.